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Gina Szanboti
Joined: 03 Aug 2008
Posts: 11586
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Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2020 2:35 am
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Tuor_of_Gondolin wrote: | Fran directly touches on this when she says that the reason the magic-users were doing what they were doing was because they *wanted* to do it. |
An assertion that doesn't seem like it would provoke the utter shock Elaina reacted with. That would seem to say a lot about her character, that she can't imagine other people having fun with magic or doing it because they want to, even though that seems to have been a lot of her own motivation from the start.
The only other thing I really got out of this episode was how weird those floating tables in Fran's room were. A table brings you tea and the moment you lift the cup to drink, it makes off with the saucer, leaving you holding the cup with nothing to set it back down on. Is that to deliberately annoy your guests or what? Even if they stuck around, they bob like fishing floats when you set something on them, which would be rather disconcerting when dealing with hot liquids.
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The Scream Man
Joined: 01 Mar 2020
Posts: 184
Location: Sydney, Australia
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Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2020 5:32 am
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From the review for episode 3:
"Like you're not wrong kid, but that feels like describing Titanic as a story about the importance of taking swimming lessons"
God did that make me laugh!
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Anneyuno1
Joined: 20 Jul 2019
Posts: 68
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Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2020 8:06 am
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Episode 5
It still paints a pretty damning picture of Elaina herself. Righting wrongs, standing up to injustice, saving people in danger (that you helped put them in), these are not important things. But there are privaleged teenagers NOT in mortal danger who idolize and worship her? Yeah, she's got all the time in the world for that. An entire episode of it. Her helping feed a town to a hungry plant monster gets forwarded right past, but we can stick around for multiple montages about how much doofuses look up to her. And the production has fallen to trash.
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Maidenoftheredhand
Joined: 21 Jun 2007
Posts: 2634
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Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2020 9:04 am
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JaffaOrange wrote: | I feel like shows like Wandering Witch are immune to the regular logic-based plot holes because they read like fables or fairy tales. Like, there's no point picking apart the plot holes of something like Hansel and Gretel. But we can and should judge these stories or the themes and messages they explore or the emotions they compel in the audience. Episode 4 doesn't really have a point to make and while the story is roughly structured like a mystery, Mirarose comes off as shady from the start and since we're never introduced to any other characters... There's no twist. We're simply waiting for the show to finish the explanation it started in the first part of the episode. |
I agree but seems most people do not. We are just going on this journey with Elaina and observing her travels both good and bad.
It also seems most people want Elaina to be a hero but that’s not what she is. She’s an observer who may get involved if something personally interests her but she doesn’t set out to the right the wrongs she encounters. I suppose one can argue that doesn’t make her a great person but I don’t feel that makes her a bad character.
If anything I actually enjoy the darker episodes most so far because I love the almost folklore quality to them. And those are the episodes that remind me the most of Kino no Tabi.
Edit: For the record while overall I enjoyed episode 3 a bit more I actually do think episode 4 has a point. Mirarose gets her revenge against her father but is left with absolutely nothing. She leads a sad existence now in that lonely castle. What happened to her lover and child was horrible and she deserved justice but what she did is not that. In the end it also seems she had lost her mind, talking to her dead lover.
And episode 4 is actually an example of how Elaina could not really help. Everyone in the kingdom had already been killed. So Elaina leaves behind the dark place Mirarose has created for herself.
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NeverConvex
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Joined: 08 Jun 2013
Posts: 2510
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Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2020 10:15 am
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I honestly think I preferred the earlier tragedies to what Episode 5 gave us. I don't think Elaina and Fran's relationship is heart-warming or engaging enough that it can carry an entire episode, and the rest of the students only received paper-thin characterization. At least with Episodes 3-4, the main cast of the each tragedy was reasonably well-realized, even if the storytelling often seemed quite confused about the feelings it was trying to evoke and Elaina felt like an empty vessel of a bystander despite being the titular protagonist.
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Gonzo_Deluxe
Joined: 01 Nov 2020
Posts: 23
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Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2020 1:05 pm
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1) It helps if you think of Elaina as "cute anime version of Rod Serling from The Twilight Zone"...in many episodes she's a very limited participant, more of a narrator.
2) as an alternative to #1, another way to view Elaina is as someone with a lot of potential character development. She's starting as a self-centered teen prodigy who doesn't really know what to do with her power other than to travel. She does seem to have some instincts as a teacher, but seems oblivious to the even the idea of "evil". If there's a "coming of age" arc in this story, it'll probably have a crisis point where she has to confront an evil that has a personal impact on her or her extended "family".
3) Apart from the hint that sensei is Nike's apprentice, there's also a hint that Nike is Elaina's mother. Which puts a new spin and closes some plot holes on a lot of episode 1. (Edit, removed ref to episode 2 here)
4) Given this interlock between ep 5 and episode 1, it's plausible to expect some "plot holes" from earlier episodes to get filled in later. But my personal opinion is that this will be limited to returning characters, like her apprentice buddy from ep 2.
In case you haven't noticed already, the show is also streaming on Hulu, not just Funimation. Hulu seems to get one or two Funi shows each season. This season it's Wandering Witch and The Irregular...Visitor Arc. There may be others, but Hulu makes it a little hard to pick out the simulcasts from the rest of their library, unless you know exactly what to look for.
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Leviathonlx
Joined: 24 Oct 2019
Posts: 84
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Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2020 6:56 pm
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This episode was another helping of showing that Elaina only cares to help if the person/people have magic ability.
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Seagloom
Joined: 04 Nov 2017
Posts: 298
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Posted: Mon Nov 02, 2020 5:34 am
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Looks like this week's episode is adapting chapter eight of volume two. Another lighthearted story with a familiar character. Bit of a shame as they skipped two chapters I really wanted to see discussed.
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CrowLia
Joined: 24 Feb 2012
Posts: 5528
Location: Mexico
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Posted: Mon Nov 02, 2020 9:58 pm
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Quote: | It also seems most people want Elaina to be a hero but that’s not what she is. |
I can't speak for others but I don't expect Elaina to be a hero. I expect her to be a relatable human being in some capacity, and the problem is she's none of that. Obviously her parents were right in wanting to teach her what failure feels like, though what was the narrative purpose of that when the story won't actually ever let her fail. And even when she does fail, she learns nothing from it, barely even reacts to it, and she certainly doesn't seem to grow or change at all from any of the people she's encountered in her journeys. I didn't expect her to solve slavery with a flick of her wand, but I would've liked her to show some sympathy towards the poor slave girl, maybe try to help her specifically, or even just reflect in her own powerlessness in that situation, realize that magic can't fix everything after all. I didn't expect her to punish Mirarose but maybe she could've felt actual fear and horror realizing what she had done, and spare a thought to the darker, more dangerous side of magic
Even when the story doesn't call for something heroic, like the latest episode, Elaina remains so unaffected by all of it. The dialogue tells me she really liked the city and was sad to leave but her expressions don't really convey that, and the episode happened so fast I can't really buy it. Maybe if this had been spread over two or three episodes and truly show us Elaina growing to love that city and spending time with her teacher and bonding with the students (them fawning over her doesn't really count as bonding), then their parting would have felt more emotional. Instead, we don't even learn any of these students' names, they're not really actual characters, just props to tell us yet again that Elaina is so awesome and cool.
I think another problem I have is that Elaina's power and proficiency doesn't feel earned. Apart from the first episode, we've never really seen her struggle. Even talented people fail occassionally and it wouldn't go against her image of prodigious if, for instance, she messed up once or twice because she can't control her power or because the spell she's using wasn't adequate for the occasion, to name a few possible examples. We didn't really see her learn and grow at all. When the student asked her what kind of magic she struggled with, it would've made her all the more real and relatable to have some weakness -or even something she's good at but doesn't enjoy- instead of her "i'm actually good at everything and never struggle with anything" response. Combined with her cold detachment from the previous tragic stories it makes her seem so full of herself, entitled and privileged, that it's impossible to like her or root for her. Rather, i'm currently hoping she'll suffer a big loss or defeat that will humble her, let her fight an uphill battle for once and actually be affected by the places and people she meets instead of impassively flying by.
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Probablytomorrow
Joined: 04 Aug 2019
Posts: 165
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Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2020 11:00 am
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I haven't been able to stop wondering what might've happened had Elaina bottled the slave girl's despair and shared it with the son. Bottled emotions seems like such a wasted plot device.
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Hiroki not Takuya
Joined: 17 Apr 2012
Posts: 2658
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Posted: Fri Nov 06, 2020 12:29 am
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I was really interested in this show so I gave it the "three episode test" (just completed). The result? I feel it can be best summarized thusly:
"Who is that gorgeous young witch girl flying by, looking like she doesn't have a care in the world because she can't be bothered to give a sht about whatever crap is happening down there because she is just passing through and doesn't want to get involved because she's awesome? That's right! It's ME Elaina..." Passu...
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Maidenoftheredhand
Joined: 21 Jun 2007
Posts: 2634
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Posted: Fri Nov 06, 2020 6:36 am
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CrowLia wrote: |
Quote: | It also seems most people want Elaina to be a hero but that’s not what she is. |
I can't speak for others but I don't expect Elaina to be a hero. I expect her to be a relatable human being in some capacity, and the problem is she's none of that. Obviously her parents were right in wanting to teach her what failure feels like, though what was the narrative purpose of that when the story won't actually ever let her fail. And even when she does fail, she learns nothing from it, barely even reacts to it, and she certainly doesn't seem to grow or change at all from any of the people she's encountered in her journeys. I didn't expect her to solve slavery with a flick of her wand, but I would've liked her to show some sympathy towards the poor slave girl, maybe try to help her specifically, or even just reflect in her own powerlessness in that situation, realize that magic can't fix everything after all. I didn't expect her to punish Mirarose but maybe she could've felt actual fear and horror realizing what she had done, and spare a thought to the darker, more dangerous side of magic
Even when the story doesn't call for something heroic, like the latest episode, Elaina remains so unaffected by all of it. The dialogue tells me she really liked the city and was sad to leave but her expressions don't really convey that, and the episode happened so fast I can't really buy it. Maybe if this had been spread over two or three episodes and truly show us Elaina growing to love that city and spending time with her teacher and bonding with the students (them fawning over her doesn't really count as bonding), then their parting would have felt more emotional. Instead, we don't even learn any of these students' names, they're not really actual characters, just props to tell us yet again that Elaina is so awesome and cool.
I think another problem I have is that Elaina's power and proficiency doesn't feel earned. Apart from the first episode, we've never really seen her struggle. Even talented people fail occassionally and it wouldn't go against her image of prodigious if, for instance, she messed up once or twice because she can't control her power or because the spell she's using wasn't adequate for the occasion, to name a few possible examples. We didn't really see her learn and grow at all. When the student asked her what kind of magic she struggled with, it would've made her all the more real and relatable to have some weakness -or even something she's good at but doesn't enjoy- instead of her "i'm actually good at everything and never struggle with anything" response. Combined with her cold detachment from the previous tragic stories it makes her seem so full of herself, entitled and privileged, that it's impossible to like her or root for her. Rather, i'm currently hoping she'll suffer a big loss or defeat that will humble her, let her fight an uphill battle for once and actually be affected by the places and people she meets instead of impassively flying by. |
I mean I disagree the episodes aren’t really focused on Elaina’s character at least not at this point so I am not really sure why they need to show her magical “struggles” . I mean yeah maybe that would make her a more rounded character but I also don’t think it is necessary for the type of episodic series this show is.
The first episode isn’t even supposed to be the first story of the novel and maybe that was a mistake of the adaption and made people expect things this series wasn’t meant to be.
Also for Mirarose she is obviously disgusted at what happened. I don’t think the series needs to spell that out. But Mirarose has already punished herself so there is no need for Elaina to do more except leave Mirarose in that lonely castle she has made for herself.
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harminia
Joined: 24 Aug 2015
Posts: 2045
Location: australia
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Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2020 8:19 pm
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I watched 5 & 6 in a row so comments on both
5: This episode was pretty boring. I liked aspects of it (like Elaina being like "i'm just gonna let myself into the magic school without permission!") but overall it was kinda eh. I agree that the relationship between Fran and Elaina doesn't really feel strong enough to justify everything. But some plot hints were dropped so I guess that was something.
The chase scene was good fun though, and I liked how they established that the magic users aren't necessarily going to become amazing witches or whatever but will just end up being a taxi service or couriers etc. I do appreciate the casualness of magic in this series. It was also kinda nice having Elaina teach people, because it makes you think maybe she could become a teacher in future after she's sick of traveling.
6: I didn't mind this episode. I'm sort of a bit eh about Saya because she's bordering on predatory lesbian joke character, but her voice actors delivery was always fun and I enjoyed her bluntness. (When she realises Elaina is there and removes the spell she'd used on the fighting dudes, causing them to punch each other and she just runs past with a "Sorryyyy~", that was amusing)
I loved the fight scene in the castle, when Elaina is talking to the king and you can see spells flashing in the background and hear Saya yelling as she fights. That was great.
Was kinda a bit over them making Elaina try to lie and say how great she is. Like, is it because she truly believes she's beautiful and has a pure heart that she couldn't "lie", instead of it actually being a truth? Because man, she kinda has a twisted personality... I do love her stuck-up attitude but that part made me slightly concerned the author is trying to say she is actually amazing and faultless when she totally isn't...
This ep was another example of trying to bring out emotions in characters that know each other but their relationship being so flimsy it kind of didn't work. I mean, Saya is clearly obsessed with Elaina and yet it feels underdeveloped..
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Florete
Joined: 21 Jan 2018
Posts: 380
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Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2020 8:27 pm
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harminia wrote: | Was kinda a bit over them making Elaina try to lie and say how great she is. Like, is it because she truly believes she's beautiful and has a pure heart that she couldn't "lie", instead of it actually being a truth? Because man, she kinda has a twisted personality... I do love her stuck-up attitude but that part made me slightly concerned the author is trying to say she is actually amazing and faultless when she totally isn't... |
Just fyi, it doesn't happen like that in the novel. Instead Elaina tries to say "I'm actually a man," and it comes out as "I'm actually a woman."
She does have a bit of a narcissistic nature in the novel but the anime seems to be playing it up.
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meiam
Joined: 23 Jun 2013
Posts: 3448
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Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2020 8:30 pm
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Quote: | to “everyone is actually an asshole all the time and only hides it to get by” |
It very much seems like that is what the author believe in or the rule the show's world, cause very few of the characters in the show have not been asshole in one form or another...
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