Forum - View topicYuri / Shoujo Ai Recommendation Thread.
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Galap
Moderator
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I personally didn't care for Simoun very much either. I thought that the characters and the war aspect were pretty interesting, and the setting had a lot of room to be something great, but the setting wasn't really ever developed at all. The show didn't really explain or go much into detail about what's going on in their world either physically (like answering the question of spoiler[what's inside the helical motors]) or socially. For something that had the unique idea of a population who consciously chooses their sex and gender upon reaching maturity, it didn't really go into what the implications of such a situation are on a society and its members. There were some great character moments , however, and I wouldn't say it's entirely not worth it, but ultimately the show for me was strongly dragged down by failing to deliver on a lot of things that I consider essential for a series that creates and has the opportunity to explore a setting like that. The one I'll strongly plug here is Blue Drop. It's funny that a thread mentioning it comes up now, since I just rewatched it a few days ago. The first time i'd seen it was several years ago, and at the time I didn't really care for it too much. Since I didn't like it it wasn't particularly memorable, so while I remembered most of the major plot points watching it again I had a hard time recalling exactly what it was I didn't like about it. The second time through, I found myself liking it tremendously, and now I'd consider it one of my favorite anime. Usually my opinions don't change that much, so it's really strange that it did. I really don't know what put me off to it before. Was I looking for something else at the time? Usually I'm ready for anything to be what it is. Did I change over the years? That's certainly possible, but I'm not sure how to really explain it. Upon consideration I think this may be part of the answer: spoiler[One thing I remember about my opinions the first time was that I didn't like how Ekaril was so burnt up over being involved in the disaster since it was an accident (well ultimately it turns out it was intentional on the part of the brass but it was accidental as far a she knew). I would have understand if it was at least partially intentional or through some kind of real negligence on her part, but it really seemed beyond her control. I think my view is different now, since I have a somewhat dangerous job and thus am responsibly for the safety of myself and a number of other people. Since it is possible for things to go wrong in ways that can be disastrous, it is my responsibility to ensure that that doesn't happen. Accidents happen, and risks are unavoidable, but I know what it's like to trust other people with your life, and have people trust you with theirs. If something were to happen and it really was an essentially unavoidable accident, I still don't think I would respond like Ekaril did, but now I understand it, what it's like to have that kind of responsibility.] Ultimately, this time around I really loved everything about Blue Drop. The slow pacing of the building romance and other relationships between the characters. They all were fairly complex people who seemed like they had real lives full of boring and interesting things, rather than just characters in a drama that serve to execute the main plot. I also like how the main romance was done, since it avoided the sentiment of "hey, these are lesbians!!!! isn't this so hot/edgy/progressive/whatever?" The relationship just kind of happens. That and everything else in the show feel a lot like real events do from the inside, complete with that ready acceptance of strangeness because it's right in front of your eyes and that muddled understanding of being in the middle of events and having incomplete information. spoiler[The whole thing about the buildup of the impending Arume invasion that ultimately comes to fruition just in time to ruin the best moment was amazingly done, how what's going to happen and how serious it is only increases in prominence over the course of the show.] This thing really shines in conveying mood and atmosphere of both places and times. All the different locales, from the run down town to adjacent elite boarding school, to the alien ships really exuded a lot of style and emotional impact. This also goes for the things that happen, too, like spoiler[ the play. I love how after a long stint of writer's block Mitch ultimately came up with the Joan of Arc play that actually seemed legitimately good, and interestingly connected thematically with the rest of the story both in content and what went into producing it.] One thing I tend to really like in general is when something has a lot of very different kinds of characters and elements, that one might trivially think don't 'belong' in the same work together. Blue Drop is an elegant dance of schoolgirls, alien battleship captains, secret agents, and new mothers, all with their own part to play in the transpiring events. This might sound a little like a cheesy mishmash in the vein of that kind of over the top anime (ZOMG high school with superpower aliens and samurai and yakuza oh my!), but in contrast, Blue Drop has all of these elements integrated in a really coherent and believable way, making the setting feel like a pretty big and real world with a lot of different kinds of things going on simultaneously. This show also has an incredible sound track, focusing on really intricate and heartfelt piano pieces. Here is my favorite example of that. All in all, I'm not sure who I'd recommend this to. The things I really like tend not to have such a big impact on the majority of other people, and I'm not really sure who else has the same kinds of buttons as me, but I don't want my saying that to bias people's views, since I'm not trying to say that this is some weird hipster thing that's too difficult for 'mainstream' people to understand or anything either. I don't know, I say it's definitely not for everyone but I think it's the kind of thing that some people may really like it (like me). Last edited by Galap on Wed Aug 05, 2015 12:42 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Lili-Hime
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Well Blue Drop made a HUGE impact on me!!  So I understand everything you feel! God you did such a great job talking about what makes the show special.... I can't really add much!
It was actually THE first yuri anime I watched after truly accepting my orientation and wow.... I was crying a lot on differing episodes. I also related a lot with Mari feeling like an outcast during high school. My personal favorite scene was spoiler[when they got caught in the rain and took shelter in that diner. Then they had that mind-meld thing happen. The closeness and connection they had really made an impact on me. It kind of reminded me of what I really craved to have with someone else... something I'd never allowed myself to have. Of course, the pool scene was very nd creative asweet as well.] I really loved the atmosphere of the show as well. It had this ominious, foreboding about it while still being comforting and happy. I suppose I can sum it up in saying Blue Drop pretty well captures that feelings of a first love. It kind of helps you figure out who you are, and the closeness is something so new and exciting it leaves a deep impact on you once its gone. Watched this show 4 times, its kind of my 'comfort' anime to watch when I'm feeling sick, along with El Cazador and a few others. |
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yuna49
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No, it has nothing like that, and no canon couples either. It's more a question of tone or subtext, which I why I said the decision whether to include it is up to you. |
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Night fox
 Posts: 561 Location: Sweden |
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@Yuna49
Are you referring to the human+android relationship, or something else entirely? A sexy android partner sure sounds like fanservice to me, but I haven't seen the show so I'm just guessing here. I'm not sure if androids should be compared to humans (or any humanoid lifeforms for that matter), though, even if they're given male or female appearances. They're robots after all. 
If you're referring to another character, then forget what I just wrote. 
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Lili-Hime
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Ah ok, then yeah maybe we should leave it out. The cliche of the otherwise straight girl groping or whipping other girls is waaaaay too prevalent to list it under yuri. We'd have to start adding stuff like Ikkitousen or Senran Kagura to the list. I'd rather keep it where there's some romantic element to stay focused. I've been burned by watching recommendations like Ga Rei Zero when the yuri is barely present, and when it is it's 100% for fanservice. @Nightfox: Not sure if you're implyfing female android & female human is not really yuri because one isn't human??? We'd have to take a few other series off the list then that involve aliens (like Izcer One and Blue Drop). Meh to me if the character is presented as female it doesn't matter, regardless if their an alien or a robot. I've only seen a couple episodes of Steel Angel Kurumi 2 and its more so cute than ecchi. It's definately way less fanservice than cutie honey, but my memory could be bad. |
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Touma
 Posts: 2651 Location: Colorado, USA |
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I feel the same. If the character looks female and the other characters treat her like a person, rather than a piece of office equipment, that is enough for me to consider her as being a legitimate part of a yuri pair. As for Najica Blitz Tactics, I have never thought of it as a yuri show. I like the show and have watched it at least three times, but not for yuri. |
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Night fox
Posts: 561 Location: Sweden |
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You're missing the point. It's not the non-human aspect that bothers me, it's the fact that androids are machines. Aliens have feelings just like humans, but androids aren't even lifeforms. They're built and programmed by someone to assist humans in various ways and as such are not subject to feelings like love, attraction and affection. A little extra silicon in the right places does not make a robot female, even if people treat it as such. Robot fetishism is not the same as yuri. Just my two cents. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
What about the gender switch animes that feature same sex romance, where one of the characters is treated as female but is actually a male "trapped" in a female body? Is that the same as if a female were to be "trapped" in a male body and fall in love with another female who thinks of her as a male? How you are treated by others does not define who/what you really are imo. Last edited by Night fox on Wed Aug 05, 2015 4:59 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Touma
Posts: 2651 Location: Colorado, USA |
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^
What I mean is that if the other characters consider a character to be female that is enough for me to consider her to be female. It is just anime. It is only entertainment to me and I really do not want to think about it any deeper than that. |
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Lili-Hime
Posts: 569 |
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Got you I didn't even know robot fetishism was a thing O__o So how long before we see Jude Law gigalo bots? lol kidding kidding  I understand the issues you would take with this. It's good that yuna49 pointed out then that the character was an android, so if people feel like robot =/= yuri they can not watch. I think most would consider Chobits a straight romance / ecchi type show, so I'd just apply the same for Steel Angel Kurumi. There is another human character though with a crush on the MC. Btw, have you seen Ex Machina? Deals a lot with the themes you mentioned.
Wow this is really an interesting point. I agree with you that how you're treated by others isn't who you really are 100%. That said I guess a show where a gender swapping character who still sees themselves as male (like Ranma 1/2) probably wouldn't qualify. Vice versa Kasamasi where the protaganist gets changed to be female at the beginning of the story and is ok with being a girl and not a guy I think qualifies. Just my 2 cents. Basically as with Steel Angel Kurumi as far as gender swapping concepts go I'd skew more inclusive then not, and just describe the show's concepts and let people make their own decisions. Some people might think about it more, like you. Others might just see two female appearing people and think 'oh its yuri'. I'll include both points of view Call it yuri but point out the caveats, if any.
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Chiibi
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I definitely wouldn't classify Galaxy Fraulein Yuna as "yuri" nor would I call Yuna "girl-crazy". She has an obsession with Paulina but it's more of a fangirl obsession like "I'M YOUR BIGGEST FAN!!" than a romantic one. All the other characters she is just "friends" with.
The second OVA doesn't contain yuri either; Ayako and Yuna only refer to each other as "friends".
Yuri her friend was actually the one who put the idea into her head....but she was tied up for real for false criminal charges; she didn't fantasize about tha partt. lol Last edited by Chiibi on Wed Aug 05, 2015 6:27 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Night fox
Posts: 561 Location: Sweden |
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@Lili-Hime
Right, as long as any "unusual circumstances" are mentioned in the description of the anime in question, then I'm fine with it. I just thought it was a valid point to address. The line's gotta be drawn .somewhere after all, even if we don't agree on where.
I haven't seen Ex Machina, though I recently read an article (+comments) that addressed the Appleseed franchise, which did sound interesting, so I might check it out. I have seen most of the GITS franchise though, which also deals with the human identity. I don't really think of the Tachikomas as male or female, but I still love them.
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Chiibi
Posts: 4829 |
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I totally forgot about Venus Virses Virus!! That was a pair I really liked....even though it was mostly subtext (the best ones normally are) The two female leads undeniably have chemistry; there is blushing and touching and even though Sumire has an interest in a boy, the show sure as hell doesn't ship them AND NEITHER WILL YOU.
I'd file this under "Implied Shoujo-Ai" if you have a category called that. lol
The official artwork does things like THIS so......yeah, it's pretty obvious what the intent of this show is. |
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Touma
Posts: 2651 Location: Colorado, USA |
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I will second Venus Versus Virus.
As Chibi said it is mostly implied, but the relationship between the two leads definitely seemed like shoujo ai to me. It was actually one of my earlier encounters with the concept. |
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Lili-Hime
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She had a pretty huge crush on Misaki as well. When Misaki first passes her Yuna gets tongue tied, can't say hello back, blushes and says 'she's beautiful...' a few seconds later. Also spoiler[ when Misaki kidnaps her later, she hopefully asks Misaki if she has a crush on her.]
You're right I could have worded this better. The tying up part wasn't a fantasy but a sexual comment Yuna made about it. (She blushed and said "Oh Misaki I've never been tied up like this before, esp. not by a woman.") Yuri didn't 'make' her fantasize about Misaki, she did that on her own. Yuri merely mentioned Misaki might have a crush on her and Yuna begins hopefully daydreaming. Also I don't think her feelings for Polylina are entirely platonic either. During said fantasy of Misaki, Misaki makes sexual advances on Yuna and Yuna says "But what about my promise to make Polylina my one and only love?" I think that'd imply heavily she wanted Polylina to her first. It seems pretty clear to me that Yuna has sexual feelings for both Polylina & Misaki. But yes the 2nd OVA series is more platonic, it's just less... comedic. I'm going off the dub and the sub could be different... but to me Yuna pretty much acts around 'cool girls' the way Usagi would act around Mamoru or Matoki. Seems pretty gay to me, esp. considering the series has sum clear Sailor Moon parody elements. Polylina's basically female Tuxedo Mask... I mean she even throws a rose! I'll move to shoujo ai though because there's no clear canon pairings.
Ok, I'll add this show! Thanks for the recommend!  Personally the subtext series are the ones that frustrate me the most I know a lot of people like to have wiggle room to say 'they could be just good friends' I want things to be as canon as possible Gotta love the 'token boy' cliche though. So many shows out there where the chemistry is so much better between two female characters but the writers pull a 'no homo' and force some random guy in. Gai Rei Zero I'm looking in your direction...
For sure More I think about it they use a lot of cliches to 'soften' the blow of making a show about homosexuality. I.e. robots, all female alien races, all girl boarding schools, guys who get turned into girls, etc...
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Chiibi
Posts: 4829 |
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Lol, I honestly don't think Yuna had a crush on Misaki. Because at the end of the OVA, there's no indication of that and the scenes you mentioned were only played for comedy. Even the Polylina scenes are comedic; you don't see Yuna thinking about her during the show's serious bits....which is why I cannot take her fangirling as romantic yuri feelings; there's just no depth or substance to it.
Usagi acts that way around Haruka and Michiru as well.....(insert any character who impresses her)....and she's obviously only into boys so no, I don't necessarily find it 'gay'. I think yuri and yaoi fans tend to exaggerate things and see stuff that wasn't intended to be seen in that light. And I don't think you do it on purpose; but when you are exposed to it so much, you WILL start to see it.....everywhere. I do it too....there are even Disney movies that make me think of things I never thought before and when I catch myself, I go "OH MY GOD. STOP". THAT'S NOT A THING.
I think you will enjoy VVV. Sumire and Lucia are super-cute....and they look so nice together! There is totally something there.
Lol, I don't mind it....but yeah best chemistry=best pairing. But despite how much chemistry Chikane and Himeko had in Kannazuki, I thought the ship itself was EXTREMELY unhealthy and sorta creepy and I was on Souma's team from the very beginning and I still am.....and I get so much hate for it.....like excuse ME for wanting spoiler[the pairing with the two super-cute characters who treat each other like precious things over the pairing THAT HAS RAPE.] I can't help but think if Souma had also been a girl, the fandom for the series would do an 180 and this thought really sickens me....because I think good romance needs to be about WHO the characters are; not what SEX they are, dammit. |
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