View previous topic :: View next topic |
Author |
Message |
|
DeTroyes
Joined: 30 May 2016
Posts: 521
|
Posted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 3:52 pm
|
|
|
I understand why DC wants to push Wonder Woman and the Justice League, but honestly, I think those are the wrong characters to push in the Japanese youth market. Especially if, as the article implies, they want to get young women interested.
A manga series based on Teen Titans (original animated, not TT-Go!), Young Justice, Batgirl (Cassandra Cain) or Supergirl would be a much better place to start.
|
Back to top |
|
|
residentgrigo
Joined: 23 Dec 2007
Posts: 2599
Location: Germany
|
Posted: Fri Mar 03, 2017 6:31 pm
|
|
|
They picked about THE worst magazine possible as a partner, no exaggeration. Do they know that it will run side by side with straight out rape porn ?
The chosen mangaka is quite generic too but here is hoping that the manga can break the adaptation curse. Batman Death Mask and Big Hero Six are about as good as you get with Japanese adaptations. Now go read a DC Rebirth book. Batman, Deathstroke and Wonder Woman are my top 3.
The original bleedingcool article by Jude Terror is about as unprofessional you get. No surprise there, that professional troll can suck it, but he was at least honest that he used google translate. Which is problematic in itself...
|
Back to top |
|
|
leafy sea dragon
Joined: 27 Oct 2009
Posts: 7163
Location: Another Kingdom
|
Posted: Sat Mar 04, 2017 1:47 am
|
|
|
Personally, the highest-profle manga author who can make this work is Tite Kubo. He doesn't have any work going on right now, he's pretty attuned to western pop culture, and his art style has the "cool" factor going for it that gels well with American comics. Or someone else can do the writing as he draws it. Then again, Kubo doesn't get along well with his superiors.
DeTroyes wrote: | I understand why DC wants to push Wonder Woman and the Justice League, but honestly, I think those are the wrong characters to push in the Japanese youth market. Especially if, as the article implies, they want to get young women interested.
A manga series based on Teen Titans (original animated, not TT-Go!), Young Justice, Batgirl (Cassandra Cain) or Supergirl would be a much better place to start. |
Yeah, it comes across as someone at DC thinking people in Japan like the same kind of stories as people in the United States. I wonder if someone there would get an aneurysm if they learned that all those anime and manga about pretty girls are actually aimed at boys and that the ones with those handsome men everywhere are aimed at girls.
I'd like to add Legion of Super Heroes to that list too, as the main characters are predominantly young. Amethyst of Gemworld could definitely work, but it's probably too obscure now--I'm sure there are more people who think of Steven Universe when they see that title (even though SU draws heavily from Amethyst).
That being said, most American superhero comics are very, very American in their settings and storytelling, and to this day still has traces of Comics Code Authority writing (such as clearly defined villains and fights involving characters throwing their powers at each other). It'd have to be heavily reworked, though at least they're on the right track here by trusting Japanese writers to do their thing.
residentgrigo wrote: | They picked about THE worst magazine possible as a partner, no exaggeration. Do they know that it will run side by side with straight out rape porn ? |
Maybe this is like that attempt with the Magic: The Gathering manga (which eventually turned into Duel Masters): Wizards of the Coast wanted some of Yu-Gi-Oh!'s thunder without really seeing what Yu-Gi-Oh! was actually about. Wouldn't be surprised if whoever chose the magazine thought manga is manga, and that it's all Dragon Ball and Naruto stuff.
|
Back to top |
|
|
Zhou-BR
Joined: 28 Feb 2008
Posts: 1461
|
Posted: Sat Mar 04, 2017 7:54 am
|
|
|
I think Teshirogi would do well at DC or Marvel. I've never seen a mangaka spend so many years drawing spin-offs and adaptations instead of creating her own stuff.
|
Back to top |
|
|
DeTroyes
Joined: 30 May 2016
Posts: 521
|
Posted: Sat Mar 04, 2017 11:48 am
|
|
|
leafy sea dragon wrote: | Personally, the highest-profle manga author who can make this work is Tite Kubo. He doesn't have any work going on right now, he's pretty attuned to western pop culture, and his art style has the "cool" factor going for it that gels well with American comics. Or someone else can do the writing as he draws it. Then again, Kubo doesn't get along well with his superiors. |
Oooo, good idea. You're right, Kubo's art style would work very well with an American superhero setting. Even Kubo doing a Superman fight would stand out. Team him up with a good writer and that could work.
leafy sea dragon wrote: | Yeah, it comes across as someone at DC thinking people in Japan like the same kind of stories as people in the United States. I wonder if someone there would get an aneurysm if they learned that all those anime and manga about pretty girls are actually aimed at boys and that the ones with those handsome men everywhere are aimed at girls.
I'd like to add Legion of Super Heroes to that list too, as the main characters are predominantly young. Amethyst of Gemworld could definitely work, but it's probably too obscure now--I'm sure there are more people who think of Steven Universe when they see that title (even though SU draws heavily from Amethyst). |
D'oh on Legion. Should have mentioned them. LoS would be an awesome choice to rework into a manga setting.
Amethyst of Gemworld could still work; do it as a maho-shojo inspired reboot, and it would be fine. Its bigger problem is that the series (from what I remember of it, at least; its been a LONG time since I read it) was pretty much self-contained from the rest of the DCU. The feeling I'm getting is that DC is looking more to emphasize its main superhero line as a way to play up its movies, and I doubt Amethyst would be the right vehicle for that.
My gut feeling is that a Teen Titans or Young Justice manga series would be the best vehicle for what DC is looking for, namely a way to introduce to Japanese audiences DC's stable of characters. Both titles have had well-received animated adaptations in recent memory, both of them emphasize younger characters and their interactions, and both groups (YJ especially) have extensive connections to the rest of the DCU that can serve as conduits of introduction. Pretty much, everything DC is looking for.
But of course, since there are no movie projects announced for either property, I doubt DC will look in that direction. So we'll probably get a Batman fight fest with Wonder Woman or the Justice League thrown in for good measure.
|
Back to top |
|
|
Beatdigga
Joined: 26 Oct 2003
Posts: 4608
Location: New York
|
Posted: Sat Mar 04, 2017 12:46 pm
|
|
|
I always liked Batman: Child of Dreams but that's more meta than anything.
I'll take a wait and see approach.
|
Back to top |
|
|
leafy sea dragon
Joined: 27 Oct 2009
Posts: 7163
Location: Another Kingdom
|
Posted: Sat Mar 04, 2017 1:17 pm
|
|
|
DeTroyes wrote: |
Amethyst of Gemworld could still work; do it as a maho-shojo inspired reboot, and it would be fine. Its bigger problem is that the series (from what I remember of it, at least; its been a LONG time since I read it) was pretty much self-contained from the rest of the DCU. The feeling I'm getting is that DC is looking more to emphasize its main superhero line as a way to play up its movies, and I doubt Amethyst would be the right vehicle for that.
My gut feeling is that a Teen Titans or Young Justice manga series would be the best vehicle for what DC is looking for, namely a way to introduce to Japanese audiences DC's stable of characters. Both titles have had well-received animated adaptations in recent memory, both of them emphasize younger characters and their interactions, and both groups (YJ especially) have extensive connections to the rest of the DCU that can serve as conduits of introduction. Pretty much, everything DC is looking for.
But of course, since there are no movie projects announced for either property, I doubt DC will look in that direction. So we'll probably get a Batman fight fest with Wonder Woman or the Justice League thrown in for good measure. |
You got a point there--it comes across to me that DC wants to increase the public presence of their A-list heroes, and specifically those. They inadvertently poisoned the well 50 years ago with Adam West's Batman, however--as that was most Japanese people's first exposure to Batman, he had since been seen as corny and campy, and it took until very recently for that to change. (Marvel's not immune either, considering Spider-Man is a mecha pilot there.) If I recall correctly, Japan was one of the few major audiences where the Christopher Nolan Batman movies flopped, because people were not used to seeing something so dark and serious out of the Batman franchise.
I don't know about how any of the other DC staples are seen in the Japanese public eye though. But the audience for musclebound super-strong flying brawler characters has been thoroughly claimed by the Dragon Ball franchise, and any Superman, Green Lantern, and possibly Aquaman stories would have to compete with Dragon Ball. Non-Dragon Ball muscular brute-force characters have a tough time in Japan, like how Kratos from the God of War video games could not catch on no matter how much the creators tried.
I would agree with you that Young Justice or Teen Titan would work way better. What they're failing to notice is the youth (or youthful appearances) of most main characters in anime and manga nowadays. But it's not something easily understood by an American who hasn't had much exposure to Japanese fiction--for the most part, American media aimed at adults, even young adults, will have adult main characters.
DC has been experimenting with this for some time now though, at least as long as Ame-Comi Girls have been around. And while there are some good stories from that sub-series, it really embodies the surface-level exoticism more so than anything else out of DC (even the original Teen Titans cartoon). I'm not sure if it has anything to do with their plans to try to establish themselves in Japan though.
In any case, if they're trying to target female readers in Japan, they need to go to a different magazine, and they'll need characters who are actually appealing to them.
|
Back to top |
|
|
BadNewsBlues
Joined: 21 Sep 2014
Posts: 6314
|
Posted: Sat Mar 04, 2017 1:51 pm
|
|
|
DeTroyes wrote: | I understand why DC wants to push Wonder Woman and the Justice League, but honestly, I think those are the wrong characters to push in the Japanese youth market. Especially if, as the article implies, they want to get young women interested. |
Wonder Woman, Batman, Superman, Flash, etc are the earliest superheroes to even be created for the medium so it makes sense for them to choose them over characters whose existence is owed to those aforementioned heroes.
DeTroyes wrote: | A manga series based on Teen Titans (original animated, not TT-Go!), |
Seems a redundant (and lazy) to make a manga off the 2003 series when it already has a comic book that was based off the 2003 series
DeTroyes wrote: |
Young Justice, Batgirl (Cassandra Cain |
Cassandra's not even Batgirl anymore.
|
Back to top |
|
|
DeTroyes
Joined: 30 May 2016
Posts: 521
|
Posted: Sat Mar 04, 2017 2:03 pm
|
|
|
leafy sea dragon wrote: | You got a point there--it comes across to me that DC wants to increase the public presence of their A-list heroes, and specifically those. They inadvertently poisoned the well 50 years ago with Adam West's Batman, however--as that was most Japanese people's first exposure to Batman, he had since been seen as corny and campy, and it took until very recently for that to change. (Marvel's not immune either, considering Spider-Man is a mecha pilot there.) If I recall correctly, Japan was one of the few major audiences where the Christopher Nolan Batman movies flopped, because people were not used to seeing something so dark and serious out of the Batman franchise. |
To be fair, Batman in the 1960s and 1970s was kind of campy. Dark, brooding Batman didn't really catch on until Frank Miller & Dark Knight Returns in the mid 1980s. And the Tim Burton Batman films didn't do too badly in Japan; tho they were a hybrid between the camp and serious Batman. Between them and Batman: TAS (which was popular in Japan), the concept of a darker, less campy Batman wasn't completely unknown to the Japanese.
leafy sea dragon wrote: | I don't know about how any of the other DC staples are seen in the Japanese public eye though. But the audience for musclebound super-strong flying brawler characters has been thoroughly claimed by the Dragon Ball franchise, and any Superman, Green Lantern, and possibly Aquaman stories would have to compete with Dragon Ball. Non-Dragon Ball muscular brute-force characters have a tough time in Japan, like how Kratos from the God of War video games could not catch on no matter how much the creators tried.
I would agree with you that Young Justice or Teen Titan would work way better. What they're failing to notice is the youth (or youthful appearances) of most main characters in anime and manga nowadays. But it's not something easily understood by an American who hasn't had much exposure to Japanese fiction--for the most part, American media aimed at adults, even young adults, will have adult main characters. |
I believe both Teen Titans and Young Justice did pretty well when they ran in Japan. Certainly, both shows generated a fan base, if the Japanese fanart for them on the internet is any indication. Therefore, a manga TT or YJ would not come into a complete vacuum.
(As an aside, does anyone know if Teen Titans Go! is running in Japan?}
As for the older characters... Marvel has done anime versions of their staple, and they seem to have done well enough that they continue to make new ones. But I suspect some of that may be more of an attempt to bring in anime-savy westerners than the Japanese audience.
It is my understanding (and anyone who knows better, please feel free to correct me) that most DC & Marvel titles are readily available in Japan (downloadable, if nothing else), and have been for decades. Certainly, the principal DC characters are not unknown to them. But whether this has just appealed to a small subset of western-interested Japanese fans or a larger general following, I don't know. So long as they don't try to lather on the heavy continuity (like, say, insist that any manga version be consistent with DC's current Rebirth continuum), it should be all right. The question really would have to come down to, which characters would appeal to the Japanese, and which wouldn't.
leafy sea dragon wrote: | In any case, if they're trying to target female readers in Japan, they need to go to a different magazine, and they'll need characters who are actually appealing to them. |
I just don't see the JL being that vehicle. Not unless they drew them in shojo style, which would be hilarious but I sincerely doubt DC would allow it.
BadNewsBlues wrote: |
DeTroyes wrote: |
Young Justice, Batgirl (Cassandra Cain |
Cassandra's not even Batgirl anymore. |
Doesn't mean they can't do it. Especially if its a self-contained series independent of the rest of the current DCU.
|
Back to top |
|
|
BadNewsBlues
Joined: 21 Sep 2014
Posts: 6314
|
Posted: Sat Mar 04, 2017 2:39 pm
|
|
|
DeTroyes wrote: | Doesn't mean they can't do it. Especially if its a self-contained series independent of the rest of the current DCU. |
By the same token though they could easily use an original character instead of one whose not all that iconic outside of the comic books.
|
Back to top |
|
|
leafy sea dragon
Joined: 27 Oct 2009
Posts: 7163
Location: Another Kingdom
|
Posted: Sat Mar 04, 2017 3:24 pm
|
|
|
DeTroyes wrote: | To be fair, Batman in the 1960s and 1970s was kind of campy. Dark, brooding Batman didn't really catch on until Frank Miller & Dark Knight Returns in the mid 1980s. And the Tim Burton Batman films didn't do too badly in Japan; tho they were a hybrid between the camp and serious Batman. Between them and Batman: TAS (which was popular in Japan), the concept of a darker, less campy Batman wasn't completely unknown to the Japanese. |
Oh yeah, I forgot the Tim Burton movie did well. (Burton himself is pretty popular in Japan too.) You're right. Batman is more popular in Japan than I give credit for. Didn't know TAS was popular too though.
DeTroyes wrote: | As for the older characters... Marvel has done anime versions of their staple, and they seem to have done well enough that they continue to make new ones. But I suspect some of that may be more of an attempt to bring in anime-savy westerners than the Japanese audience. |
Heh, that'd be a weird, roundabout strategy, and The Animatrix is the only case of that I know about that's worked. But it is an interesting idea, to get manga readers who would normally not read DC's regular comics, and hopefully to get them to buy the comics later as well. Not sure how it'd work though, as, again, the storytelling between manga and DC's usual fare is pretty different.
|
Back to top |
|
|
Baggie_Saiyan
Joined: 10 Jul 2016
Posts: 152
|
Posted: Sat Mar 04, 2017 6:34 pm
|
|
|
Wait Japan gets WW in August?!?! Damn.
|
Back to top |
|
|
Dr. Wily
Joined: 09 Nov 2007
Posts: 383
|
Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2017 10:53 pm
|
|
|
DeTroyes wrote: |
As for the older characters... Marvel has done anime versions of their staple, and they seem to have done well enough that they continue to make new ones. But I suspect some of that may be more of an attempt to bring in anime-savy westerners than the Japanese audience. |
Tell me you're not talking about the Marvel Mangaverse, please. Wasn't that generally considered awful by everyone?
|
Back to top |
|
|
DeTroyes
Joined: 30 May 2016
Posts: 521
|
Posted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 1:10 pm
|
|
|
Dr. Wily wrote: | Tell me you're not talking about the Marvel Mangaverse, please. Wasn't that generally considered awful by everyone? |
I was mostly referring to the previous anime versions of Marvel properties that have come out, like the anime Iron Man, X-Men, etc. And they've just announced a new one (Marvel Future Avengers). Someone must be watching them, or they wouldn't continue to be making them.
Full disclosure: I haven't actually watched any of the Marvel shows, just have heard about them here and elsewhere. (more of a DC guy m'self).
|
Back to top |
|
|
|