Forum - View topicNEWS: Otakon Enforces Copyright at Artists' Alley
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Ohoni
Posts: 3421 |
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I'm talking legality. I don't see why Otakon would pursue the issue beyond what the law would prohibit. |
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TheShadow99
Posts: 32 |
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There is a good reason why they do that & with several people living in Japan that post here on the forums I'm surprised no one has mentioned this... But doujinshi and several other types of fan works are protected under Japanese law. It's very similiar to the US clause about parody works based on other works. So if your an artist in Japan for 'company X' & your characters appear in Doujinshi, then like it or not you can do absolutely nothing in 90% of all cases (there are certain things that aren't allowed). So if you want to earn money off of what the other artists do with your characters, your best chance is to create 'official' status and charge a percentage fee to the artists for that status or gather what you consider to be the best derivitive works and offer to release a 'official compilation' and give that artist a cut. Both work fairly well. Unfortunately the US has laws that only protect one form of derivitive work and that's parody. Few fan works can fall under this and even if you consider it to be parody the company in question may not. Penny Arcade is a good example of what happens then. They created a comic stripe that involved something hallmark (if I remmeber correctly, it was them or american greetings) trademarked, Penny arcade being about making fun of just about anything this shouldn't legally be a problem. However the greeting card company threatened legal action and Penny Arcade couldn't afford to spend years in court to challenge it so they eventually took the stripe down (though they created a parrody of the whole mess as their next stripe). Personally I think big bussiness has cost americans alot of cultural ability and a system like Japan's is considerably better. I however cannot afford to buy senators or congresscriters like big bussiness can, so I know I will lose every time. |
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RezSav
 Posts: 542 |
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You're telling me I could've been making money off of someone else's work this whole time!!!
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Colonel Wolfe
 Posts: 370 |
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I applaud the copyright owners for taking the advantage on this matter, where it concerns bootleg anime but I think they have taken the rabid approach where it concerns the fanart genre. I can see where the Doujishi might be concerned but if they are selling fanart, who cares?
These anime con organizers are literally biting the hand that feeds them because if this spreads and more and more anime cons take this approach anime cons as we know them are going to cease to be. The reason to this is because dealers are going to stop buying space and could force these cons to cancel events. Fanart should never be prevented from getting sold by either dealers or those who buy booth space. I know if I were to buy space and I was prevented from selling some fanart that I had purchased from someone to sell I wouldn't attend that con in the future. Comic Cons don't usually have those kinds of restrictions. If they find bootlegged anime, the staff of the con can confiscate them but where it concerns fanart, they don't usually have a problem with it as these convention organizaers realize that's where some dealers make some of their money from and support the genre although they don't authorize it. |
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Joe Mello
 Posts: 2262 Location: Online Terminal |
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Final policy or not, this is kind of a mixed bag. I actually think it depends on the investment put into the work. Making a doujin isn't cheap; a lot of time, energy, and money is put into drawing, inking, printing, and binding. Fanart on the other hand probably doesn't cost as much nor take as long to create. I'd enforce it more for them than for doujins.
I don't know how much copyright licenses cost, but I'm willing to bet they aren't cheap. If I were making a fan doujin, I would be utterly concerned that any sales that I could make at Otakon would just go to cover the license and not to covering the overhead, making the idea of a doujin a losing proposition. (Of course, remember that not all doujinshi are based on anime characters. We've had stories on this very site about original doujin manga.) I understand the need to enforce copyright laws, but there's just some negative feeling associated with this. As Otakon grows, it slowly becomes more and more like a corporate entity both out of will and out of nature. As this progression continues, the question will inevitably come up asking if something typically run by fans can be as enjoyable when it's run by the private business sector. |
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Godaistudios
Posts: 2075 Location: Albuquerque, NM (the land of entrapment) |
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As I've read through the posts and seen that it's not yet the official policy, one has to wonder what other effects may come about if this policy does become official. Does this mean that doujinshi will also become banned in the dealers room because it is also essentially unlicensed fanart? After all, there isn't much difference between person A selling it in artist's alley and person B selling it in the dealer's room. It's not like the doujinshi is somehow magically licensed to be sold just because the work was purchased elsewhere by the dealer. Perhaps it falls under a different legal category, but should it really? As long as the base principle is the same, I don't see why it should.
Somehow, this comes off as being completely inconsistent. |
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noneko_Mamimi
 Posts: 41 |
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yeah, really...There were two other posts from otakon staff, saying so...but, no one seemed to notice 
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neko ewen
 Posts: 30 |
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So, copyrighting stuff is actually affordable, though it could add up if you have any substantial number of works to copyright, and it's not strictly speaking necessary, just very, very handy if you wind up getting into litigation over it. |
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Zeiram
 Posts: 317 |
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this doesn't make sense from an anime fan's perspective, i mean it seems we are at the forefront of challenging existing legal norms in the copyright side of things. i say there should be laws, but there should also be choices made by those who own such things as to where litigation results outweigh just leaving it be. just because you can sue doe snot mean you should sue.
the riaa attempted to talk the judge into making it illegal to have documents held under 'intelectual copyright' within a shared folder on your computer. i have 4 computers, what crime am i committing? supposedly sony attempted to burn a code from the system (ps3) on to a disc played on it so that disc can only be played on that system, this was deamed illegal The riaa also attempted to sue lyric and tabulature sites because it somehow fit in the vague description of a ruling they gained. They backed out upon realizing the backlash potenial. why do people sue when they have a right to? art is to be embraced, the fans are to be hugged not sued. make us happy and we will make you happy. meh that it. |
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Zac
ANN Executive Editor
 Posts: 7912 Location: Anime News Network Technodrome |
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Uh, the thread was marked "Official Changes for Artists Alley - 2006", posted by RachaelAnn, Department Head. Two people anonymously wandering into our forums with zero presentable credentials saying "I'm an Otakon staffer, this isn't our policy!" means nothing. I need proof that 1. they're actually Otakon staffers in the first place and 2. their word means more than or trumps the forum post. |
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Iniksbane
 Posts: 62 Location: The great state of Mary |
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Ok somebody stop me if I'm smoking crack here, but isn't part of copyright litigation that the accused has to prove actual harm (in this case monetary). I know this applies to fair comment/criticisim (which is the exception that parody falls under) so that if someone produces something that would hurt sales of the product than that person can be sued. Does fanart really do that? I'm not really sure whether the convention organizers or the fan artists would have to worry about litigation.
And I have seen the previously mentioned posts, that this is not settled law. But it is an interesting discussion. |
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Cassandra
 Posts: 1356 Location: Birdsboro, PA |
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For what it's worth, jvowles is the President/Con Chair of Otakon and MistressChimera is the Chief of Staff. Both are on the Board of Directors. |
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Zac
ANN Executive Editor
Posts: 7912 Location: Anime News Network Technodrome |
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Then they should have said so. I have no way of knowing that. Honestly, if these aren't official policy changes then don't allow the Department Head to post them under a thread called "Official Policy Changes", without any language that suggests these rules are tentative and not final. |
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.Sy
Posts: 1266 |
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Fanart is definitely a big attraction, and a lot of artists do a lot of Naruto fanart and such. That's really too bad, but if they have to do it, they have to do it. This probably had some external pressure working, because I don't see the harm in fanart. I wonder though, if I drew some Naruto fanart and "sold" it for some Pocky...
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LaLuna.RuniGustav
 Posts: 6 Location: Mrrr |
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You might not be making money by BEING the character. But if your not skilled with a sewing machine do you know how much money is spent to someone else to tailor make the costume based on someone elses Original designs. Lemme tell you it's far more then then someone selling a doodled character on a piece of paper for $5.00. As an artist I make next to nothing on my original pieces. As nice as they are no one wants to see them. They want to see beautifully rendered character art. Something that'll wow the person. As an artist I never charge a person then a % of the price from the materials I use. My prices are based on the materials + the time I spent laboring over the piece of art itself. My originals will always be worth more because those are MY creations. It's one thing to stop fanart if the art that's done is an obvious tracing from a screen shot or manga page. But if the artwork has it's own original style and flavor then why stop it? :¯\_(ツ)_/¯: one way or another I'm curious to see what happens in the final ruling at Otakon. It'll probably be a very empty year in the Artist Alley if this does go through. |
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